Who the Folk?! Cincinnati is Cincy Jewfolk’s new podcast spotlighting the diverse voices shaping Jewish life in the Queen City.
Hosted by Cincy Jewfolk’s editor Sam Fisher, the series features conversations with notable and fascinating Cincinnati Jews—from artists and entrepreneurs to community leaders and culture-shapers.
Each episode dives into personal stories, passions, and perspectives, showing that Jewish life here is anything but one-size-fits-all. The Who the Folk?! Cincinnati podcast is part of the Jewfolk Podcast Network and a product of Jewfolk, Inc.
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Be sure to check out the entire series and follow along as Sam interviews and features notable Cincy Jews & Jews doing interesting things in the Queen City!
Introducing this week’s WTF?! Cincinnati’s guest
Jackie Congedo is an innovative executive leader known for driving organizations toward success with an unwavering commitment to excellence.
With a proven track record in guiding teams and executing strategic initiatives, Congedo brings a wealth of experience in development, marketing, communications, stakeholder engagement, and education to address antisemitism and other contemporary issues. Her extensive network within Jewish and civic communities underscores her passion for fostering meaningful connections and collaborations.
A nationally recognized expert in the intersections of antisemitism, extremism, and civic engagement, Congedo is passionate about the power of education and engagement to catalyze change and build community across lines of difference. She joined the Nancy & David Wolf Holocaust & Humanity Center’s leadership team in July of 2022 as the Center’s Chief Community Engagement and External Relations Officer, where she has played an integral role in growing a team of seven to more than 25 mission-driven professionals. In July 2024, she was selected to lead the organization into its next chapter and will assume the role of Chief Executive Officer in August.
With extensive experience in advocacy, government and public affairs, and marketing, she has led a robust portfolio of initiatives to build and refine brand awareness for the organization while expanding relationships with key stakeholders, donors, influencers, and policy makers. Congedo’s strategic efforts have helped elevate and activate the Center’s mission in impactful new ways– redefining the role Holocaust education can play in addressing some of society’s most complex challenges.
During Congedo’s tenure as Chief External Relations & Community Engagement Officer, the Center’s award-winning museum saw record-high attendance and gained national attention for its leadership in Holocaust education and combating antisemitism.
Congedo has grown the Center’s philanthropic base, quadrupling annual giving and corporate fundraising, and tripling public funding, including securing the organization’s first-ever federal earmark. She also oversaw the establishment and growth of a fee-for-service vertical that has engaged more than 50 organizations, generating significant revenue within its first year. She has cultivated relationships with donors and funders that have enabled dramatic expansion of public programming, the creation of digital storytelling initiatives, and considerable growth in school district partnerships and engagement.
A former journalist turned community advocate and bridge-builder, Congedo spent six years as the director of the Jewish Community Relations Council of the Jewish Federation of Cincinnati, which works to ensure Jewish security by working in coalition across diverse communities to build a more just society for all people. In this role, she served as the chief architect of the Leaders in Light Institute, a leadership development program for civic influencers designed to address trends of extremism and polarization and to strengthen democratic practice and civil society. Congedo has served on various community boards and committees, including the National JCRC Directors Association, the National Jewish Council for Public Affairs Restructuring Task Force, the City of Montgomery Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion Committee, and the Cincinnati Regional Coalition Against Hate.
Prior to her work in Cincinnati’s nonprofit community, Congedo spent nearly a decade as a broadcast journalist, working for stations in Washington, D.C.; Lexington, Kentucky; and in Cincinnati, Ohio, where she specialized in enterprise and investigative storytelling. Congedo received a BA in journalism from the University of Maryland’s Philip Merrill College of Journalism, where she graduated summa cum laude. A native Marylander, she has called Cincinnati home for more than a decade.
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Show transcript
Sam: Jackie Congedo, welcome to Who The Folk. Let’s just start with the first question, the easiest question, where do you come from?
Jackie: Yeah, so thanks for having me, Sam. It’s great to talk with you. And the answer to that question is suburban Maryland. So I’m not a 513 native, I’m not a Cincinnati native, I am forever an outsider. It seems like people sort of never let me forget that here. But at this point I’ve been here for 15 years. It’s the longest I’ve ever really lived anywhere, other than as a kid, growing up. So I grew up outside Columbia, Maryland and Howard County, and now, now I’m here in Cincinnati.
Sam: Well, it’s been 15 years, so I will bestow, you know, naturalized Cincinnatian.
Jackie: Oh, thank you. I think you might be the first one to do that.
Sam: Yeah, I think that’s long enough. 15 years is a long time.
Jackie: People, It’s the area code more than anything. I think that gives it away. Everyone’s like look at this, 443, who is calling me.
Sam: So we gotta, we gotta update your phone number, yeah. But even now, they don’t give out 513, anymore, there’s a new area code.
Jackie: Oh, I don’t think I really, what is the new area code?
Sam: I don’t remember, but I just read a story about it. Probably over a year ago, the metro area has reached capacity.
Jackie: Wow. Okay, well, I’m not part of that problem, yeah. For now.
Sam: For now. So you’re from suburban Maryland. How did you end up coming to Cincinnati?
Jackie: Yeah, so it was a, it was a twisted voyage in broadcast television news that brought me here. I started at a 24 hour cable station in Washington, DC, called news channel eight, which was in house with the WJLA ABC affiliate, WJLA in Northern Virginia. And, you know, it’s like a dream, when you’re in journalism school to land a job in the number seven market. And it was a wild ride. But I was, I was my own, everything I shot, edited, reported. You know, back when that was the cameras were still big, but you were expected to do it all.
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: You know, the idea of a one man band, and so leaving there I, you know, I knew it was going to be pretty hard to just stay there forever, transition in a way that was going to allow me to have a, you know, a meaningful sort of career in DC, because you’ve got to go, sort of like, earn your stripes.
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: And so I, I applied all over the country. Took a job in Lexington, Kentucky for the number one station there as a nightside reporter, put the camera down, worked with a photographer, you know, got got better at sort of competing for that top slot at 11 o’clock and honing some of my, you know, relational reporting skills and contacts and all the things that go into what makes a good reporter and and met my now husband in Lexington, who was also a reporter, and he, after our three year contract cycles were up, he started a week after I did in Lexington, so we had contracts up at the same time, and we’re looking for the next thing.
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: And I interviewed with Channel Five, which is a Hearst property, thinking that I would just sort of do a three year stint, contract cycle, two or three years in Cincinnati, and then head back to Baltimore. And Hearst has a reputation for sort of promoting from within. So perfect. I’ll just, you know, ride the train in Cincinnati back to Baltimore, and never imagined really that I would, I’d find myself really falling in love with the city and the community here, and also my husband, you know, who his his family’s from Western Kentucky, and so, you know, for a lot of reasons, it made sense to stay. It’s just I realized one day that, like, you know, as we were saying, there’s a lot of ways to make a difference in the world, and there’s really only one way to be on TV. And so I looked at my, and that’s never why I was in it.
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: So I started thinking about what might be next, and that’s when I took the leap into Jewish professional work.
Sam: Yeah, And where did you first make that leap into? Was it straight to Holocaust education or…
Jackie: Yeah, so it was actually in public relations for the Federation. So I joined the Jewish Federation in 2015 as a PR manager, and then was promoted internally when the JCRC role opened about a year and a half later, and led the JCRC for about seven years with my buddy Justin Kirchner, who’s now the AJC director in town. And after seven years, you know, it just started to be sort of time to think about what might be next, and the center was growing at the same time. And so this amazing opportunity opened for me to step into a new role of, you know, a lot of what we do at HHC, really, implicitly, is also community relations, right? I mean, it’s not, it’s not our reason for being, so to speak. You know, it’s a space of education, of Holocaust education, but it does, I think it is an incredible front door in so many ways for the Jewish community and the Jewish story, and sort of the Jewish narrative, and really a gift to the city from the Jewish community. So it’s just a privilege every day in the role that I’m in to be the ambassador for that work.
Sam: And how did you sort of go from, you know, what was the first position, I guess, that you took up at the Holocaust Humanities Center? Was it a straight jump from, like, Federation, you know, just, just like, Oh, I’m gonna jump in and just jump into, like, giving tours. Am I going to just jump in to be the person who’s outreaching to people and bringing in tour groups, or?
Jackie: Or yeah, so we can all blame Sarah Weiss for this. Yeah, the wonderful Sarah Weiss. And in all seriousness, she is an incredible friend, colleague, mentor. I mean, Sarah and I have so many, go back many years now, in many different chapters, and we worked together when I was in PR at Federation. She was leading the JCRC, and then she left JCRC, which she was doing, allegedly part time, allegedly interim for eight years.
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: Full time, basically, while she was also running the Holocaust center when it was at Rockwern. And so time came for her to look at what it would take to move the center to Union terminal, and to really invest her energy in making that happen, which, now that I’m in this role, like, just, I don’t even, I’m still kind of convinced that there’s, like, three Sarah Weisses out there, and we just don’t know,
Sam: Yeah, she’s got,
Jackie: There’s definitely, yeah, like, twins, at least triplets, maybe running around. So she left, focused on her one full time job at the center, after many years at the JCRC, and I happened to, you know, was sort of recruited, and it was really privileged to step into that role. And then seven years later, as you asked, I, you know, as the center was growing, I reached out to Sarah and and, you know, she knew that things, things, the moment, really demanded more from our mission.
Sam: Mhmm.
Jackie: You know, it was actually, many people don’t realize this, but it was, it was actually right around the same time that that the center received this incredibly generous gift to really turbo charge our work,
Sam: Mhmm.
Jackie: And so, so I was brought on as an as a chief External Affairs and community engagement officer to really oversee marketing and development and external partnerships and sort of the brand, the external positioning, generally. Sarah, very shortly after I started, decided that it was time for her to,
Sam: Yeah, to go.
Jackie: To take another step. And so I’m thinking to myself, like, you couldn’t have told me this, like, you know, a couple weeks ago, no. And in all seriousness, like, you know, when people follow their path, it’s always clear to them, and it becomes clear to other people and whatever time they need. But the reality is that’s not important. And was important as it was time she felt it was time for her and to be on to other things and and so, you know, we entered this period of interim CEO leadership with David Wise, who has become a wonderful friend and mentor, and and David and I really worked together for two years to to grow the organization, and sort of the structural footprint of the organization in terms of what we had the capacity to do in significant ways, I would say, almost exponentially.
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: And so when the time came for him to really think about, he was, he was always committed for that interim chapter to say there’s a lot of sort of growth that needs to happen. There’s some new structures, and he has a tremendous mind for operations and systems, and so there were some things that needed to be implemented. And so he was committed to getting the organization kind of through that chapter of growth, or initial sort of, you know, exponential growth. And then when it came time to look for a new permanent CEO, I threw my hat in the ring. I always say, you know, I had two years to date HHC,
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: And because I really believe strongly that in order for, for something to be good, for the mission to be good, you know, it has to go. It’s like a two way street.
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: And I wanted to make sure that as much as it was going to be a good fit for me, that I was going to be a good fit for it, that what emerged in terms of the capacities needed in that CEO role were things that I could deliver, that I had to bring to bear. And it just so happened, and the way the organization evolved that it was, it really, you know, was a CEO with a strong focus on external, you know, vis– partnerships, and it’s not visibility, but sort of the external footprint,
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: You know, the positioning in the community and the relational work, and so it just made a lot of sense, I think, for everybody, but it’s been, I mean, I’m now coming up on a year in this role, and it’s flown by, and it’s, I really consider it like the privilege of my life to be able to do this work.
Sam: I mean, and sort of having you in that role, are you being in that role with your background in journalism, talking to people, reaching out to people. It’s even more relevant because right now we are in a moment of isolation from within the Jewish community, or outside of the Jewish community, where bridge building is kind of what’s on the table and what’s needed. Yeah, right for the moment.
Jackie: Yeah, I think, I think that we have to really just try to stay at tables, even though they’re uncomfortable and they’re getting hotter and more uncomfortable by the day. I mean, I look at what’s happening on the I don’t know, I used to say far left and far right. Now I just say sort of the ideological, in some ways, left and right. And it’s very concerning, and I think that the way that we push back up against those forces is to insist that actually the center is a good place to be, that we can find consensus that traditional structures of like democratic structures, small d, work. And they’re worth investing in, things like community, things like civic duty, responsibility, ownership, education, and so I see HHC playing a role in being one of those pillars in the community that can be a place for that.
Sam: Absolutely. And now, you know, not to backtrack a little bit, we’re going to backtrack a little bit into the past, kind of, you know, we kind of know where you’re from.
Jackie: We plowed right ahead.
Sam: As we should. These are complicated times that require complicated conversations, and nuanced middle ground, as Amy Spitalnick told me the other day.
Jackie: Yes, yes, I love Amy.
Sam: She’s great. But kind of going back to just your background, how you came to Cincinnati, all that stuff, you know, you were in journalism for a long time. Kind of your raison d’être before moving on.
Jackie: Yep. Yep.
Sam: I know fancy words, yes. And you know, was there something growing up that made you want to be in journalism? Was there something that drew you to it, or drew you to wanting to be somebody who kind of communicates, or a communicator?
Jackie: Yeah? Yeah. Yeah, I think I don’t know. I’m really a curious person. I love, I love, I love, sort of the art of communication. I’ve always been kind of a crafty person, like I was an arts, I was the kid who had like a billion craft kits, because for my birthdays, everyone knew she likes crafts, and so they’d just get me, like, rock painting, weaving, face paint, you know, all the different things. And so for me, like this craft of journalism was really appealing, because it was, it was about working sort of on this super dynamic medium where you can, where you can, you know, work in rhetoric. You can work with sound and video to put together a story that moves, moves people to tell, tell a story to and so. So for me, it was really, it was kind of an art form that I just loved doing and and I believe really wholeheartedly, I say I’m like a recovering journalist, because I I believe wholeheartedly in sort of that, you know, the the fourth the fourth estate, right? Yeah, like, the role that informed citizenry plays in our democracy that enshrines our freedom and guards against, you know, all the other bad things we don’t want. And so I always felt that it was a real responsibility, even at the local news level, to be trusted with that sort of sacred duty of conveying the facts. And so, yeah, it felt like something that was a worthwhile use of time.
Sam: And that’s something I feel like just kind of looking at what your what your job is now, where your career has led you, where it’s sort of the same thing.
Jackie: Yeah.
Sam: Where there’s a lot you’re entrusted with, with different stories and from not that long ago, but different stories that need to be told still.
Jackie: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think there’s some, when I look back in hindsight about, like, my own journey. And sort of what led me here, there are a lot of parallels. There’s a lot of like through lines, you know, the whole idea of a strong democracy and informed citizenry. The dangers of propaganda, the dangers when people lose access to real information, we stop agreeing on what facts are. These are all lessons of that chapter of history and of course many others. And I think, yeah, the art of storytelling and the, the sacred art of being the keepers of these stories and these facts is very much at the core of what we do at HHC.
Sam: When you were growing up, kind of like, as this curious kid, this kid that’s kind of like, into storytelling, and then moving into adulthood, was there part of your identity growing up, part of your Jewish identity, or anything like that? Were there stories that you were connected to, or was that just kind of not on your radar yet?
Jackie: Yeah, it’s so interesting, like, that’s, Sam, a whole, like hour long podcast in and of itself, is my own Jewish journey. I was raised in a home with an interfaith home with a Catholic dad, Italian Catholic dad and Jewish mom. Eastern Europe, you know, family comes from Eastern Europe several generations back, and we were very secular. We had a very secular upbringing. I say we celebrated everything and nothing. Yeah, dyed easter eggs and then, like in a pinch, we’d use it on the Seder plate. You know, it was all this stuff that just made, in hindsight, absolutely no sense. But I think what it did is it built this foundation in me, of like, difference is good. Of, you know, there are multiple paths, and it really wasn’t until, so I kind of had that like that, that the seed planted, and this idea that you know that, that we can pursue what’s right for us, and there are multiple ways. And then it really wasn’t until you know when you throw yourself into a career in journalism, unless you luck out and you do Jewish journalism like you,
Sam: Well, my path to this is all,
Jackie: A different deal?
Sam: A whole other podcast.
Jackie: Okay, well, I want to hear that too at some point. Yeah. So you know, when you throw yourself into journalism, you have to just, you just gotta, it’s all in the basket. You’re just like, Yeah, I’ll work whatever holiday you want. I’ll move wherever you want me to. I’ll work whatever hours you need. Like, there’s no other, the way I say it is, there’s no room for any other identity.
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: In so many ways. And part of that is, like, kind of important, because you have to be sort of unaffiliated in order to objectively report on things and and part of it’s just the logistics of the of the demands and the role that kind of keep you isolated in some ways, and we’re without connection. I guess that is isolated, and so I think, like it wasn’t until I had the space in my life to explore identity and Jewish, Jewish identity, and sort of my own connections with that and where I felt sort of where I felt connected, that I, that I really had any real understanding of my own Jewishness, to be honest. Yeah. So, yeah. So I don’t know that there was anything as a, you know, as a child that, like, spoke to me Jewishly about journalism. I think that I was raised in a home where questions and education and culture was, was it was part of the culture and was valued, and where curiosity was something that was cultivated. And I think, in hindsight, a lot of that came from, from Jewish values.
Sam: Yeah, and also It came from kind of this American combining of multiple stories where there are multiple truths to be to be held just, not just within yourself, within your family, then within community, and then also working as a journalist, right? You have to hold those multiple truths,
Jackie: Yeah.
Sam: Working as a JCRC director, multiple truths, right? So it’s all just, there’s a great through line,
Jackie: Yes! Of multiple views, totally. I think that’s what I said when I was interviewing for the JCRC role. I said, I feel like I’ve been, like, I’ve been preparing for this for my whole life, just like,
Inherent in my own life’s journey. I’ve always been at the crossroads of different stories and identities and in some ways they conflict but it’s always been completely synergistic in my, in the way I’ve experienced them.
Sam: Yeah. So sort of kind of moving, moving with that, not past it, but with it. You know, this kind of feeling, this this connection to this complicated middle, I guess that will say, well, we’ll borrow Amy’s words, this complicated middle into your life, you know, was part of, like, the friction when you were working as a journalist, kind of, looking to get out. Was part of that friction, because you were starting to identify more with,
Jackie: Yeah, with an identity.
Sam: Was that part of the friction?
Jackie: Yeah, I think there were a couple of things. I mean, I think I. Again, I realized that there are many ways to make a difference, in one way to be on TV, and I felt in some ways like the unique qualities that I bring to the table weren’t the ones that, they just they weren’t the ones that were necessarily lifted up and valued in a space of like broadcast television, in particular, you know, the the sort of the thirst for depth and the capacity for complexity. And I mean, none of that happens in a minute and a half, which is sort of, for those listening the traditional timing of a story on the evening news, a minute and a half, 90 seconds. And I think that I did actually, also I remember a couple of moments where, you know, there was one moment, actually, towards the end of my time at Channel Five, where, you know, we were covering the landmark Supreme Court case of, you know, the Obergefell case and gay marriage and legalization of gay marriage.
Sam: Which one?
Jackie: Yeah, that’s true. This was long before these landmark cases. This was back in in 2015, 2014, 2015 and and I remember, you know, the mandate, which wasn’t the fault of my producers or anyone else, it was, there’s two sides to the story. Go get the other side. And I remember thinking like, is there really another side?
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: Is there really another side to, like at what point do…and part of that’s just the organic evolution. It’s like the role we have to play as journalists, to reflect the societies we live in in a way that holds up,
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: Those conversations and tension points. But to your question, that was the first time that I felt like, wait a minute, you know, I actually thought for a while that maybe I’ll go back and, like, do some doctoral research on, like, you know, at what point in the civil rights movement did we stop saying there’s a legitimate other side?
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: And thinking about now, like, you know, there’s a lot of complexity in the history of the Holocaust and in World War Two. And there’s, it’s like, really a canvas, I think, and a tremendous sort of tapestry to understand the complexity of human nature, for sure. And there really is no other side. There really is no legitimate other side, like, I’m not going to entertain a denier, right, or someone who is explicitly anti semitic, so I don’t know. I think, I think you’re right. I think there was some feeling that maybe there’s a better way for me to contribute.
Sam: Yeah, it’s kind of like, that,
Jackie: That’s more aligned.
Sam: That Howard’s Zinn quote, you can’t be neutral on a moving train, right? It’s like, it’s hard to be neutral when things are happening, especially when they’re things that you believe in,
Jackie: Yeah.
Sam: Or don’t believe in.
Jackie: Yeah.
Sam: And, you know, from that friction, obviously, we talked about how you went into your career in Jewish Cincinnati, moving on to that and that kind of like in your role now, in your life here in Cincinnati. You know, earlier, We bestowed on you the
Jackie: Honorary title.
Sam: Naturalization of your Cinncinatti-ness.
Jackie: Thank you.
Sam: How has it been, adjusting to that. Adjusting from like, kind of people still viewing you as sort of like a transplant to this community? What kind of, what’s been like dealing with, with that?
Jackie: Yeah, I mean, I would say at this point, like, I’m laughing because I don’t feel at all like a transplant anymore. In the Jewish community, for sure, and actually even more, even in the civic community, community too. I feel like people know it when they see my area code and when they ask me what high school I went to,
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: But like, other than that, no. I mean, I, I’m at the farmer’s market on a Saturday, I can’t go to the farmer’s market on a Saturday and not see, like, a billion people that I know and know through work and know through personal, know through both. I mean, it’s, it’s all and that, I think, is part of, like, the beauty and the challenge with being a Jewish communal professional is it’s all mixed in one kind of messy, wonderful tub of life and experience. And I feel that, I feel very much like I get to work with and for family I do, and we have a great team at HHC, which I think is a little less traditional in terms of the landscape of, sort of the Jewish community, and then the landscape of the organizational makeup, you know, we’ve got, I think half of our employees are Jewish, probably are there, about the other half aren’t, and our board reflects the same diversity and so, but even there, we have a real family at HHC, like, it’s an amazing team of people who are so committed to the work and the mission and each other. And yeah, I just, I just, I just get to come to work every day and say, like, how do I not mess this up?
Sam: When did it start to feel like you were from here? For you, like, when did you start to feel that sort of…
Jackie: Yeah, you know, I’ve, I’ve, no one’s asked me to reflect on that before, but like, the the immediate answer that comes to mind is, when. I, when I, I think, in that JCRC role, I think it was once I started, once I knew that there was somebody I could call if, like, my electricity went out and I needed to, like, take a shower in the morning before going, you know, like, I need, I need a shower. And now, you know, you get married, you have, you know, buy a house, you have kids and your kids, so that that’s a whole other level of like, integration and community. But even before that, I really felt that way, embraced that way as, like an insider, or someone who belonged in the JCRC role. I felt like I was very much like welcomed in, which was really, was really great. It was, was great, and still is great.
Sam: Yeah, I love that. And now, for my clunky transition to the next phase,
Jackie: Yes.
Sam: We’ll come back to some of this I’m sure, but we’ve got a time crunch,
Jackie: A hard deadline.
Sam: A hard out, so we’ve got to honor that and acknowledge it, so we’re going to move to some of our Jewfolk-y questions.
Jackie: Yes.
Sam: Which are, like, you know, they’re fun. So first thing, since we were just talking about Cincinnati, we’ll start with this one. Usually, this is the last one. We’ll start. Okay, so what’s your favorite thing to do in Cincinnati? Like on an ideal day? So this is, like, any day you want it to be right? This could be a day without kids, without work, right? It’s just your day to do whatever you want.
Jackie: So I would say, I love our neighborhood. We live in Montgomery, and I just, I love where I live. So I think it probably would just be like a day around home, farmers market for sure. Love the Farmers Market in Montgomery on Saturdays. And then I’d probably get a coffee at Deeper Roots, and then I probably would go out to Turner Farm and do the you-pick flowers, because I love to make a bouquet.
Sam: I mean that sounds like,
Jackie: It’s a great day.
Sam: I want that Saturday, it sounds lovely.
Jackie: Yeah, you’re welcome to come along for the ride anytime. Usually there’s two screaming kids along with you, though, so I’ll warn you on that.
Sam: That’s okay, I’ve got a nephew, I know.
Jackie: You seem like you can manage that.
Sam: Yeah, cause I don’t have to go home with them at the end of the day.
Jackie: That’s right.
Sam: Yeah, I just have to bring treats.
Jackie: Yeah, no, the treats are the secret.
Sam: I’ve found that’s the way to go in a lot of situations.
Jackie: Do we ever really grow out of that?
Sam: Never. Do you have a favorite Jewish writer, or teacher?
Jackie: Yeah, so I read a lot. I sort of defer when I feel like things are really complicated, particularly in the way of, like, Israel and the issues and global issues and sort of peoplehood issues to the Shalom Hartman Institute, Danielle Hartman and Yossi Klein Halevi is like one of my idols. I think he’s, he probably would, like, shirk at the term ‘idol’.
Sam: He probably would.
Jackie: You can just imagine that. But I just think he has a way of boiling down and just just distilling, perfectly distilling, such complex ideas with such heart, in a way that can still hold that capacity for, like, how to wrestle with things. And, yeah, so both, both, I think Shalom Hartman and I think I think Halevi has written for them on a number of occasions. He’s like, involved with them.
Sam: Is there a book of his that you have come back to?
Jackie: I am more of an article, periodical person than a book person. In all honesty, I think part of that just has to do with the moment in life that I’m in and the bandwidth I have for, like, long form reading. I long for the days when I could just crank through books, but now it’s like I’m so tired by the time I lay down to read or sit down to read, like it’s, you know, it’s three pages forward, two pages back, like it’s just, it’s kind of hard to do. I need the audio. I really need to get into the audio on the audio book wagon. But I love a lot of the things that he’s written in, like periodical form, and I do love letters, letters to my Palestinian neighbor.
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: I think it’s just a really beautiful articulation of so many concepts that are foundational about who we are as a Jewish people. Let you know, let alone the conflict or how to talk about that. I just thought it was, it’s a helpful articulation of how to talk about Jewishness and Jewish identity, which has left, left an impression on me.
Sam: Is there a quote or a saying, maybe from him or someone else, whoever you want it to be, that you kind of come back to that grounds you. When you’re doing this sort of work.
Jackie: There’s a couple. I love Ruth Bader Ginsburg, I think, said, “Pursue justice or pursue change, but do it in a way that inspires others to follow you”? I think that’s really important. It’s not just pursue change at any,
Sam: At any cost.
Jackie: At any cost. It’s like we, you know, we can get there fast, fastest, or we can get there, you know, in a way that’s whole that sustains, that lasts. And I realized that there’s a certain amount of privilege, speaking in that right urgency of people who don’t have certain privileges that I do. It’s different. And in some ways, the identities I have, you know, also have that urgency. But I think that I’ve always been one to think about, like, it’s not enough just to get there first. We have to get there together. Like, how do we get everybody there together and or bring people along? How do we serve as, like, that translator that can help others come along too. And then I love the Hebrew, the whole concept of, like, Tzedakah and Tzedek, and the idea that, like, I don’t remember where I was when I learned this, but I remember it being a profound moment of awareness around, you know, Tzedakah and Tzedek meaning justice, and the idea that you know, we are. We are when we give, we are of ourselves, of our time, our money. We are actually engaged in the sacred act of justice,
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: which I think is like, so beautiful. It’s just the most, one of the most beautiful concepts, I think, in all of, all of Jewish thought tradition,
Sam: And it dovetails into your, into your work, from, from where you started to now.
Jackie: Yeah, exactly.
Sam: Telling the truth, right? As a journalist, tell the truth even now.
Jackie: The last one, which is important, there’s a third one, is Dr. King’s, the moral arc of the universe. This is not a Jewish one, but the moral arc of the universe is long, but it bends towards justice. And I think that’s, that’s another one. That’s another one that’s like, you know, do the right thing, but do it in a way that inspires other people. It’s like, does. Let’s not lose perspective. You know that it’s not, it’s not a straight path. It’s like, again, it’s like me reading a book three, three pages forward, I have to reread two pages. Like, you know, we’re going to have, like, fits and starts and but we have to have that faith, and we have to be grounded in the fact that progress, enduring progress, is, is, is an arc.
Sam: Yeah, it’s not a straight path.
Jackie: Yeah? That bends slowly in some ways.
Sam: Yes it does. yes, yes, it does. The next Jewish question, and I will say this really quick, having a quote or phrase that’s from a non Jewish source, I think is great.
Jackie: Okay, great.
Sam: It isn’t a requirement.
Jackie: It doesn’t make me, I don’t have to surrender my honorary 513 status?
Sam: You don’t.
Jackie: Okay, great.
Sam: Do you have a favorite Jewish holiday?
Jackie: I love Passover. I feel like that’s so, so basic of me. But I really do love Passover. I also love the ritual of Shabbat. I know it’s not a holiday, but I love the ritual of Shabbat. I love, actually more now with kids, I love Sukkot. I just think the feeling of the season, being out in the Sukkah, the fact that it’s so grounded with like the natural order of the seasons, is so cool.
Sam: It’s very, getting back in touch with nature.
Jackie: Exactly. In fact, I used, I had so much fun hosting break the fast for Yom Kippur a couple years ago, and we went and picked all of these flowers from Turner, and then made little centerpieces, so beautiful. So, yeah, you’re right. I love, I love that. But I also love, I love Passover. I love the way, the fact that Passover is like an evolving story of, that you’re a part of. You know, it’s like and, and the fact that this retelling of the story every year, every I feel like every year, or maybe every couple of years, I like, derive new meaning from it because of where I am in my life.
Sam: Yeah. It’s like going back and watching, or reading a book you’ve read before, or a film you’ve seen before, and each time you view it,
Jackie: Yeah, it’s like the book isn’t different, but you’re different. So you can receive different wisdom from it. It’s cool.
Sam: Do you have a favorite way to celebrate Shabbat? Like, what is your special Shabbat ritual?
Jackie: I love doing Shabbat with friends. I think it’s really fun. I you know, I think it’s easy to get, like, bogged down and like, oh, okay, we’re having people over Shabbat, and you gotta make that, oh, the house has got to be clean, and so much cooking. And now I just it’s like, the fact of being in company with other people who are grounded in a space of gratitude and ritual is like, great, and it doesn’t matter if it’s carry-out, and it doesn’t matter if it’s just like pizza and we’re raising the crust because we didn’t have time to do a challah or whatever. It’s like, holding the ritual and holding it in the company of other people who are aligned is really, I think, actually, particularly these days, so healing. So yeah, I would just say with people I care about and love, and my friends and family, and not letting any of the formality of it get in the way of doing it.
Sam: And, is there anything that you want to tell us about, anything we should look out for from you or from organizations you work for in the future?
Jackie: Yeah, well, I mean, we’ve got like, a banner year coming at HHC. We’re now in it. You know, past the fiscal year mark, we just crossed the threshold of an amazing, amazing probably, I think, the best yet Upstander month with, like, record engagement at the gala and the 5k and whole Upstander night at the Reds ballpark. And, you know, these amazing stories we’re able to lift up, and Jesse and Katherine Switzer. I mean, it was just, it was awesome from start to finish. So we’re coming out of June with a ton of momentum, and we’re headed into the fall. With celebrating the, I guess, commemorating and celebrating the 80th anniversary the end of World War Two, in partnership with the museum center with this amazing liberation ball we’re going to host. And this is a direct like, really, in honor of and in tribute to this core group of survivors who actually held a liberation ball every year to celebrate,
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: You know, the end of the end of the war, and sort of be together and reflect and, and be grateful. So we’re doing that with the museum center 1940s weekend, September six and seventh. We’ll have a liberation ball and 1940s day, and that’ll be really fun. And then we’re headed really right on the heels of that into this incredible community learning opportunity, with the Auschwitz exhibition coming here in October through April, that is soaking up so much of our, I think, our organizational bandwidth, and for good reason, it’s gonna, it’s gonna be highly impactful. Hundreds of thousands of people coming through to hear these stories, and we’re grateful and really excited to be lifting up local stories of survival along with this, so that’s going to be amazing. And then, right on the heels of the Auschwitz exhibition leaving Union Terminal, we’re going to be opening our first temporary exhibition called Holding Hope, which we haven’t talked much about yet,
Sam: Okay.
Jackie: But this is based on a portrait book that was just published, which I’m also really not supposed to talk about,
Sam: Okay.
Jackie: Because people will ask me for a copy. And I’ve been told by our director of collections and exhibitions who I love and adore, this is the exhibit catalog, do not like. Hand out these books just yet. So a couple of people have them. Obviously, the survivors who allowed us into their homes to photograph them and hear their stories have copies. It’s a beautiful collection of, sort of candid photos and handwritten quotes of wisdom from 41 local survivors, half of whom we really had engaged with before, the other half of whom are new to the mission,
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: And many of them Russian speakers. So we partnered with JFS to do this in a way that was going to be sort of on their terms and turf and comfortable for them. And many like, I mean, many of these stories have never been shared before in this way. So we have the portrait book, and now we’re working with the photographer to design this special exhibition, which is going to be really beautiful. And so that’s coming to Union terminal in March, and will be with us through the spring and early summer, yeah, and then, and then, oh yeah, by the way, over the summer next year, we’re redesigning our entire humanity gallery.
Sam: So big things are coming.
Jackie: So we’re closing the whole thing, ripping it out and redoing it. It’s going to be really, I mean, that’s actually, that’s worth, like, a real conversation.
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: Because we’re doing something I don’t think that really has been done before related to, like, think about it less as a humanity gallery and more as an Upstander experience. So I’ll sort of leave you to like,
Sam: Okay.
Jackie: Think about what that could be.
Sam: Okay, I’ll ponder. And you know, now there’s two more things to sit down and talk to you about.
Jackie: Yeah, there’s a lot to talk about this year.
Sam: And final question, what’s giving you hope right now?
Jackie: Oh, that’s a great question to end on you. I feel like we’re both reading the same in books on, like, what, how to interview these days,
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: And, like, what to, what to leave people with?
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: Because I think, like, hope is such a it’s, what’s interesting about hope is, it’s, it’s, actually, I want to say it’s like, you know, a rare commodity, but it’s not. It’s not because hope actually has very little to do with, well, you know, hope is one of those character strengths, the 24 character strengths that are going to be featured in our humanity Gallery, and that you can take a survey and understand what your top strengths are, and use that as a toolkit to understand how to be an Upstander. Shameless plug. Hope is one of those 24 characteristics, and hope actually is something you can cultivate.
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: So people think like, oh, well, I’m just hopeful, or I’m not a hopeful person. There’s been science like psychologic, psychological, you know, science out of this field of social psychology, that research that by practicing a few kind of ritual, sort of thought exercises a day that you can become more hopeful. So that, in itself, is hopeful.
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: You talk about what’s giving me hope? Like, that’s incredibly hopeful. And I also think that, like, you know, it’s a really hard world out there and, and I think it’s so easy to get, like, stuck in that place of just like doom about the world, and you know how little we are in it relatively. But I think that Viktor Frankl and Man’s Search For Meaning really kind of changed my perspective about this, and it came along with this tough time and in the world and my own, sort of like trying to find, it was after October 7, trying to find some grounding. A friend of mine suggested that I read that, and what it taught me, and sort of what I’ve been like understanding more and more every day is actually there is great joy. And purpose, in agency, in your own agency, and even in situations like concentration camps, where Viktor Frankl was, when he sort of was thinking and doing some writing even about this. Even in the darkest of places, you still have the agency to decide how you respond to it. And that is, it seems like so sort of, you know, like, okay, whatever. Like, you know, is that really something that makes you feel good? But actually, the more I focus on that. Like, all I can control right now is X, Y and Z, and I’m going to do the best job at that. And like that really does give me a lot of joy and gratitude and hope.
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: And I think if we were all just more focused in our own worlds on how we cultivate more hope in ourselves and how we can do what we can do within our spheres and what we can control, then the world would be a better place, and we’d be happier people. So, yeah, that’s my hopeful bit.
Sam: That is hopeful.
Jackie: Is that even in the darkness, there’s a lot of there’s a lot of light. You just have to be as my daughter said, This is my four year old who’s like a Buddha.
Sam: Yeah.
Jackie: She’s like, Yeah, I mean, this girl is so, she’s like, such an old soul. We were driving her to camp one day. My husband said our school, and he said, you know, June, it’s really like, it’s a day, like today, it’s really gloomy. There’s like, all these rain clouds out. And she goes, Dad, there’s always rainbows. You just have to know where to look for them.
Sam: Wow.
Jackie: She literally says, four years old. I’ve never said this once to her, you’d think, like, Oh, you guys fed that. No, no. This is, like, organic out of her mouth. So there really is, there really are bright spots, and you can have joy in knowing that you have the control of how you navigate even dark, even dark stuff,
Sam: You just have to, to look for the rainbows.
Jackie: Look for the rainbows. Make the rainbows.
Sam: Jackie, thank you so much for being on the Who The Folk Cincinnati podcast. The Who The Folk podcast is part of the Jewfolk Podcast Network, and it’s a product of Jewfolk Inc. Please help us out by subscribing, rating, and reviewing the show wherever you get your podcasts. If you have a suggestion for Who The Folk Cincinnati podcast guests, send me an email at [email protected] and join me next time when I sit down with another member of our community. For our other shows, check out Cincyjewfolk.com/podcast.
